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Offline neptune

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« on: May 07, 2007, 12:53:22 PM »
,a
unless otherwise stated views are my own.
bob Atkinson rtd

Offline maverick

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« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2007, 11:25:27 PM »
Ummm, I believe this post should more rightly be placed in the Nautic12 forum, as my understanding is, that this boat was the precursor to the N12.

However, I do stand to be corrected.

Furthermore........., could anyone possibly imagine in their wildest dreams that this is an EC12? I think not. Just look at the conditions, and how this boat is handling them. This is no EC12.
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Offline neptune

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« Reply #2 on: May 08, 2007, 07:06:04 PM »
WELL SAID MAV :oops:
unless otherwise stated views are my own.
bob Atkinson rtd

Offline IanHB

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« Reply #3 on: May 08, 2007, 08:13:00 PM »
Dear Mr Maverick, is it your suggestion that an EC12 in the conditions shown on this video would behave differently from the craft illustrated ?

You are correct that this is in fact the  model that is produced in Sydney as another class of radio yacht based on the Australia II design.

http://www.12metreyacht.com/

The video shows the difficulty successfully using overlapped headsails on a radio yacht.
Great hard on the wind but ugly when eased. IMHO.
Do it NOW, before it`s too late!

Offline maverick

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« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2007, 11:56:26 PM »
Oops and Ouch! I think I may have trodden in something I saw coming and ought to have avoided.

Quote from: "IanHB"
Dear Mr Maverick, is it your suggestion that an EC12 in the conditions shown on this video would behave differently from the craft illustrated ?


Sir, I can see how you may have come to the conclusion you have. And I am sure though that there will be many expert and experienced sailors that would have the skills to make an EC12 behave in a similar manner to the boat shown in the video. But alas, I am not one of them, and I may have been more referring to my own lack of skills in sailing an EC12 in these conditions, .... I think. :D Thank you for your most polite enquiry.

You also made the following comment.
Quote from: "IanHB"
The video shows the difficulty successfully using overlapped headsails on a radio yacht. Great hard on the wind but ugly when eased.

to which I add mine.

I agree that in some situations the Genoa looks fantastic and in others not so good. One could possibly live with the less attractive appearance provided that there was some performance advantage to be gained overall. But if not, then I would be more than happy to stay with a conventional rig as applied to most radio yachts.

Now, if only there was a way to fit a spinnaker........... perhaps, but I don't think I will go there. Foot already getting dangerously close to mouth aperture. :shock:
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Offline neptune

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ooops
« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2007, 07:25:27 AM »
Mav you are supposed to sail the Foot(y),not eat them  

Foot already getting dangerously close to mouth aperture.   :roll:  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:
unless otherwise stated views are my own.
bob Atkinson rtd

Offline maverick

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« Reply #6 on: May 09, 2007, 12:50:36 PM »
Thank you.

I feel much better now that situation has been clarified.  :oops:
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Offline IanHB

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« Reply #7 on: May 09, 2007, 09:18:42 PM »
Is this the sort of thing you mean?




Do it NOW, before it`s too late!

Offline maverick

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« Reply #8 on: May 09, 2007, 09:47:41 PM »
Damn!!!!

Just when I was starting to think it was safe to go out for a sail again, these pictures appear.

From the captions I guess these are on an America's Cup class R/C boat - the big suckers. But sure looks good.

I think I want one, even though it looks more like a giant genoa than a spinnaker, but still, it doesn't look half bad.

Foot very very close to mouth now.

................ I'm thinkin'............... maybe.......... possibly............ gleam in eye............ something to try on a calm day. Just for fun. Wonder if anyone's made something this big for an EC12 sized 12-metre before.

Ian, you shouldna done this. Putting notions in a young boy's head like this can be dangerous. :shock:

Let's see now, where can I get some material just big enough and light enough and strong enough. Hmmmmm.

Then, you just put a little flysail inside the genspin. Gosh, where will it end?

Time to sign off I think.
maverick
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Offline ancient one

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« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2007, 05:37:42 PM »
A couple of misconceptions . the first, the maker doesn't come from Sydney.

As Ian said with that type of rig it doesn't sail on some points of sailing and again you can see how unbalanced the hull is with this big Genoa is. Do you think a world famous designer would let a boat like this go out sailing like that?
ld enough to know better, to young to resist.

Offline Alan

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« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2007, 08:38:55 PM »
Is this enough of a spinnaker for you then?






Offline ancient one

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« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2007, 01:57:41 PM »
Nice paint job?
ld enough to know better, to young to resist.

Offline maverick

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« Reply #12 on: May 11, 2007, 03:35:59 PM »
Spinnaker looks fantastic Alan.

Does anybody know what sort of boat is it on?

But now I'm intrigued. What happens when sailing upwind?

As for some other comments about pulling the bow down, what about making the spinnaker smaller?

And I for one would not give up on having a play, just because it may not have worked right in the past. One day, someone WILL come up with a good workable system. In the meantime, I will still play when and if the opportunity arises.

No way do I want to shut my mind against the possible success of something like this, just because it may not have worked in the past. There would be no progress if everyone thought like that. Hooly Dooly!

Looks like it's time to sign off again. :shock:
maverick
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Offline Burt

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« Reply #13 on: May 12, 2007, 09:45:01 AM »
Quote from: "ancient one"
A couple of misconceptions . the first, the maker doesn't come from Sydney.

As Ian said with that type of rig it doesn't sail on some points of sailing and again you can see how unbalanced the hull is with this big Genoa is. Do you think a world famous designer would let a boat like this go out sailing like that?


Ancient One

I have read here, and in the Nautic 12 section your comments regarding the genoa on this type of RC yacht. I would like to add my two bobs worth.....
Firstly I must say I am very suprised by such a negative viewpoint! I have met the builder of the the boat and found him to be one of the most enthusiastic supporters of the 12m class and a very nice young man as well.  (you are correct about location, he is ex-Sydney, now based in Newcaslte) I have seen and sailed both the silver boat shown in the movie (a very early version) and later versions of that model (for those interested it is an Australia 2 class hull - the originator of the N12). I find your comments about pushing the bow down (in the N12 section) quite strange as I don't notice anywhere in that movie the bow being "driven down" as you say and at no point did the boat appear to be out of control. The boats I have steered are very well balanced and are very nice to sail.

As for your comments regarding a world famous designer, I'm sure many of Mr Lexcens designs didn't work straight out of the box (Austrlia 2 included!) but what made him a great designer was his desire to have a go and try something new rather than just copy the norm. As a big fan of the N12 Ancient One, I'm sure you would understand how easy it is to copy something!

I welcome any comments

Kindest Regards

Burt Semple

Offline Alan

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« Reply #14 on: May 12, 2007, 01:12:33 PM »
Quote from: "ancient one"
Nice paint job?


If you mean MS Paint you are wrong :D

It is a real boat, IOM NZL 185 called XPDNC, with a real spinnaker (made out of plastic supermarket shopping bags). I will admit that the sailplan is slightly illegal for an IOM :wink:
I have a sequence of photos taken that day, but if I show them it would give away the secret of how the boat went up wind.